7.2 inches. With modern powders you may gain 100 fps with a 100gn bullet. It is arguably the perfect deer-sized cartridge. After extensive testing, he agreed. Detachable, steel sling swivel studs and a contoured, effective recoil pad are standard equipment. The attributes credited to the Long Ranger check many boxes regarding the desirable features of a deer rifle. The commercialized version restored the 20-degree 45-minute shoulder angle of the parent 7mm Mauser case to be the cartridge we know today. Bullet weight is implicit in the KPS formula, because bullet weight is included in computing sectional density. Examples include Remington, Winchester, Savage, Kimber, Ruger and several others. The cartridge was designed to be a versatile round that could be used for both hunting and target shooting. While its been eclipsed in recent years by sexier, faster, bigger cartridges, its still worth a look if youre in the market for a new deer gun. rifle with extra detailing (hence the XTR designation) in a number of they do not come in around 2.223 inches, they are trimmed back to meet I've had 3 different Ruger 77's in 257 Roberts and all have shot really well. Its simply too much fun to shoot! That's a valid reason to demand extreme accuracyand it's amazing how many of today's basic, inexpensive factory rifles deliver. This accuracy situtation with the Bob has me reconsidering doing this. In the last few decades of the 20th century, a reintroduction of .257 Roberts rifles from some majors let younger generations discover this venerable cartridge. following year. Winchester introduced a +P version with a MAP of 58,000 psi in the mid-1980s. (Hornady HITS is explained in the Appendix.). The 257 Roberts is a classic cartridge that has been used for hunting medium-sized game for decades, while the 6.5mm Creedmoor is a newer cartridge that has gained popularity in long-range shooting competitions due to its excellent accuracy and low recoil. To find this range, I generated a trajectory table for the load, using 5 yard range increments. The .257 Roberts cartridge does not deserve to be shoved into obscurity. inches. I used the Guns and Shooting Online Rifle Cartridge Killing Power Formula to calculate Killing Power Scores (KPS values) for loads of interest. I read down the energy column of the table until I came to the energy value closest to 1339 ft. lbs. I once owned two different Rugers in .257 RBTS, the first a M77, the second a M77MKII. Here is a ballistics chart of the 257 Roberts with a 100-grain spitzer bullet: bind, purchase some 7x57 brass, neck it down to .25 caliber and fireform The cartridge has remained popular to this day due to its versatility and performance. The bullet is very stable in flight, so it will retain its accuracy even at long range. Thus, HITS scores are keyed to that distance. If that roberts is an early one, I would bet it is in the barrel where the problem is. Varget seems to be a barnburner with a 75-grain bullet, so I tried 41.0 . (SD is the ratio of a bullet's weight in pounds to the square of its diameter in inches.). Performance of modern .257 Roberts factory loads. Ackley, the modified 257 Roberts was likely the best improved round . Loads with 95 and 90 grain bullets have EKRs of 205 and 175 yards, respectively. By comparison, the fastest heavy bullet .257 Roberts factory load (Hornady Superformance) drives a 117 grain bullet at 2946 f.p.s. It seemed that the company was testing acceptance of such a reissued The 117-grain Roberts factory load has commonly had a roundnose bullet, just like that in the .25-35. Whenever any of these variables change, the KPS number changes proportionally. This is a standard 100 grain .243 Winchester factory load at a MV of 2960 f.p.s. You can get a box of the Federal load mentioned above for $100. With MAP limits pegged at 52,000 CUP, 7000 CUP higher than the Roberts, they threw smaller diameter, lighter weight bullets at higher velocities. Should have kept that one and played with it some more. The 257 Roberts is based on the 25-20 Winchester case, which itself is derived from the 32-20 WCF case. Ultimately, it comes down to personal preference. For hunters wanting deep penetration, the Barnes 80- and 100-grain Tipped Triple Shock X-Bullet and Hornady 90-grain GMX are proven choices. The .250 Ackley Improved was developed by Parker Otto Ackley, P.O. He also decreased the shoulder angle to 15-degrees and trimmed the case neck a bit. However, in thumbing through my notes from many years ago, factory loads generally run between 50 and 100 fps slower than claimed velocities when fired from the 22-inch barrel of the Ruger M77R. Built with a 20 inch barrel, this rifle/caliber combination could become a hit with knowledgable hunters and Henry would own the .257 Roberts rifle market. Mikey Hartman, Lt. Col. rifle. Today, factory ammo from Remington (and Hornady and Winchester, too) shows only the 117-grain weight. The does a great job on deer - it holds together very well at the high velocities possible with the AI case and I have found it to be very accurate. Wolfe Publishing Company | 2180 Gulfstream Suite A | Prescott, AZ 86301. The total increase in capacity is about 4 to 5 grains, depending on which brand of case is used. For those who hunt in open country where longer shots are expected, the relatively new Hornady 110-grain ELD-X (with a G1 B.C. hunting loads tell the same story. load detailed above is a very strong one. Its not a small game cartridge and its not a dangerous game cartridge. The .257 Roberts is a better deer cartridge than the .243 Winchester. In One of Tom's all-time favorite cartridges. Roberts, in his initial attempt in designing this new cartridge, wanted The only other significant option for anyone wanting a new rifle chambered for the cartridge is to order a semi-custom Shaw Mark VII bolt action. Have a friend, bought a ruger.. in 257 roberts. To begin the ballistic analysis of the loads, I used the point blank range calculator at www.shooterscalcualtor.com to calculate a +/- 3 inch maximum point blank range (MPBR) for the load. It was developed by gun writer and experimenter N.H Roberts in the 1920s and 30s, so its not a stretch to assume the cartridge has been around for nearly 100 years. Benchmark and H-335 were neck and neck, with IMR-4895 following suit. some bullets grouped better than others, and most loads were accurate Around 1909 they completed the project with I feel this even more strongly after making a detailed examination of the performance and capabilities of the cartridge. Most . Today, few Accuracy was around an inch; good enough to get my buck at differed somewhat when it came to the subject of reloading the Wolfe Publishing Company | 2180 Gulfstream Suite A | Prescott, AZ 86301, Swift A-Frame Revolver and Pistol Bullets. The actual range at which the Roberts load falls to a KPS of 15 is 340 yards. The Nosler 85-grain Ballistic Tip is another great choice that reached nearly 3,300 fps using Winchester 760 powder and was likewise accurate. 100 grain flatbase MAY be ok. New Ruger. These are mild recoil levels that would be conducive to comfortable, accurate shooting with the rifle and caliber. Remember that old childrens story, Goldilocks and the Three Bears? Some take the moral as a warning against breaking and entering, but most folks probably remember the storys lesson about moderation: not too hot, not too cold, not too hard, not too softjust right. the handloading route. The consent submitted will only be used for data processing originating from this website. (22 inch bbl. .257 Load #1: Nosler Custom, 115 gr. just under 250 yards. After that, all cases are checked for length, and if We show you how. For comparison, the .30-06 has a MAP of 60,000 psi. Tht said, I've not seen any that shoot REALLY bad. I have had real good luck and accuracy with both IMR and H 4831. If we take the Roberts with a 100-grain bullet at 3,000 I did some estimates of recoil with the heavy hunting loads I have featured. Otherwise, hunters hoping to help resurrect the .257 must reload their own ammunition and look in the used or custom-built market for a firearm. shoulder angle. Simply put, the Effective Killing Range (EKR) of a given cartridge/load is the distance at which the bullet has enough killing power (i.e., an adequate KPS value) to dependably dispatch a particular size/type of game animal (assuming a vital area hit). If you really get in a it for small game and varmints hunted at longer than normal shooting During the 1980s, Winchester developed a .257 Roberts +P load that featured thicker case walls and was loaded to a maximum average pressure of 50,000 CUP, which bumped the velocity of the 117-grain bullet to 2,780 fps. Just remember that at those distances, even the smallest mistake can mean missing your target entirely. Manage Settings I concluded that the HITS system is useful only for the purpose of verifying the size/type of game for which a given cartridge and load is best suited. The hottest commercial .243 Winchester load I can find is quoted as driving a 100 grain bullet at a muzzle velocity (MV) of 3120 f.p.s. Note that the EKR of the .243 Win. We have a gun show in Charlotte this weekend, and I was planning on taking a NIB .243 Ruger M77 to the show in hopes of trading it on a .257 Roberts. It's not a screamer and it's not a slowpoke. For primers, stick to standard brands. broke at 3.25 pounds right out of the box. I may hold my nose and stick with the .243. 1 in .257. Ultimately, it is important to select a caliber that meets your individual needs and preferences. However, it is still best to weigh every charge if trying to squeeze out the utmost accuracy. Hodgdon 4350, IMR-4831, Alliant Reloder 19 and IMR-7828 rounded out the Based on personal inspection and range testing, Chuck wrote the following summary assessment of the rifle: "The Long Ranger is an ideal woods rifle, as it has a fast, smooth, rack and pinion action with a six lug, front locking, rotary bolt. To allow the cartridge to reach its full potential, ammo companies in the 1980s began producing +P loads. While it lacks the power and range of other cartridges, the 257 Roberts is a popular choice among those who value accuracy and light recoil. History [ edit] I have a tang safety M77 in the Roberts, and mine is very accurate. velocity was increased by roughly 130 fps and 100 fps, respectively. (The .243 was offered in the Winchester Model 70 and other fine rifles, while the .244 was offered in the clunky Remington Model 722.) I am only stating what the numbers show. After some reflection and data crunching, I decided that a KPS of 15 is a reasonable and realistic baseline killing power value for hunting deer and similar game with a conventional 150 grain FP or RN .30-30 load. My purpose here is to propose (or plead for) a resurrection of the .257 Roberts as a significant choice for hunters who want a capable, yet mild shooting, rifle for pursuing deer and similar size game, Zinn writes. Understand that the few commercial cartridge brands and loads currently available are loaded to pressures approaching the +P limit and modern rifles can handle those pressures without difficulty. Interlock RN, MV 2350 f.p.s. In spite of greater case capacity, the Niedner was handicapped by a lack of slow-burning propellants until after World War II. Not surprisingly, shooters flocked to the new fast cartridges, especially the .243 Winchester. It features a straight-grained walnut Once again, the EKR is stated as the MPBR range (275 yards), because the KPS value of 16.9 at 275 yards is greater than the baseline KPS of 15. My Son recently bought a Kimber 84M Select Classic .257 Roberts that has been sub MOA with every load we've tried. I dont know how many years my dad has left, so I want him to have the best I can afford that fits his needs, Zellers said. The Roberts became parent to one of the best-known wildcats of all time: the .257 Roberts Ackley Improved. The .243 Winchester: Its Capabilities as a Deer Cartridge, The G&S Online Rifle Cartridge Killing Power Formula: Implications and Applications, Determining the Effective Killing Range of Rifle Cartridges, 100 yard KPS = 20.7 (Energy = 1602 ft. The calculator uses bullet weight, diameter and 100 yard impact velocity as inputs, and the resulting HITS score is interpreted as follows. Note that MV is estimated for a 20 inch barrel, not the 24 inch test barrel used to derive published factory load ballistics. it ain't the cartridge. The .257 Roberts is one of those cartridges that has a storied It should also be noted that this data is intended for rifles built with a SAAMI specification chamber, so it might be problematic in rifles with a wildcat chamber. For hunting it has quite acceptable accuracy, but from benchrest my better barreled 257R rifles outshoot it. It has a muzzle velocity of over 3000 feet per second, and can easily take down game at long range. Its not a screamer and its not a slowpoke. The .257 Roberts. Discussing this issue in detail is outside the scope of this article. If it is 1-12, then keep the bullet weight down to 87 grains. The only watch-point for the Hawkeyes in .257 Roberts is that I thought this was a limited production run originally billed as an ultra-light rifle. : 2.535" Powder: 41.0 gr 43.7 gr Vel. extremely adaptable to most powders in the medium burning range. Ruger's No. The solid top receiver comes with Weaver type scope bases already mounted at the factory, which eliminates the need for a front sight that can catch on brush and branches. If (and only if) that is the case then the barrel is short (20") and the contour is very thin*. M. Joined: Jan 2017. They are tougher than older 117- to 120-grain bullets and can penetrate as deeply while having a higher launch velocity. So far, Boddington's Dakota .257 Roberts produces its best groups with Remington 100-grain round-nose Core-Lokt, not the most ideal hunting load for a flat-shooting cartridge. Not the best choice for longer range work but it kills like a lightning strike inside of 250 yards. Magnum primers are not needed (22 inch barrel). The preceding history/background is necessary to understand the distinction between the original .257 Roberts cartridge and its later variant called the ".257 Roberts +P." First on the list was IMR-3031 with lighter bullets. If you are looking for a round that can do it all, the 257 Roberts is an excellent choice. Several big deer statesincluding Michigan, Ohio, Iowa, and Indianahave passed laws in the last five years allowing straight-wall cartridges in zones previously designated as shotgun- or muzzleloader-only. Nosler offers a box of 20 cartridges for $93. It balances between the hands and points naturally. Joseph Von Benedikt shows his custom 500 and how well it shoots. ", "The Long Ranger is as accurate and reloader friendly as a bolt action, faster for repeat shots and the absence of a bolt handle sticking out of one side makes it more comfortable to carry, in the hand or slung over either shoulder. Ned Roberts of New Hampshire was the other part, and in fact was the deciding factor of a host cartridge later to bear his name. casually mentioned the Roberts was on the way out. This isn't your grandpa's muzzleloading system. Free shipping for many products! However, Remington still offers a standard pressure load that pushes the 117-grain Core-Lokt at a more leisurely 2,650 fps. However, the .243 Winchester cannot match the .257 Roberts as a big game cartridge, although the .243 is arguably a more efficient heavy varmint round. Gunsmiths can help, but most of the time, a few relatively simple DIY steps will overcome the model's inherently finicky nature and produce admirable hunting-level accuracy. case capacity of roughly 53.0 grains of water, many modern powders work I rest my case that the .257 Roberts is the more powerful of the two cartridges for hunting deer and similar Class 2 game. summer woodchucks to bigger game out West, I found this cartridge The quarter-bore was fashionable due to fine game performance demonstrated by the .250 Savage. I for one limit my long-range shooting to 300 You may have to special order it from your local gun shop or online retailer. It should be noted that when using top performing powder measures such as Reddings Competition Precision Riflemans PR-50, many extruded powders can be thrown accurately. Its a bullet diameter bracketed on either side by wildly more successful bullet diameters, he said on a recent episode of the Vortex podcast. Weldin Accuracy was around an inch; good enough to get my buck at just under 250 yards. load of 41.0 grains under a 100-grain bullet, and I tried it with a Since this was my first time out West for antelope, MPBR and zero distances are rounded to the nearest five yards. However, for handloaders wanting standard pressure data, starting and maximum loads should be reduced by 5 percent. Deadshot Boxed Combo Shooting Bag - Unfilled. Joseph Von Benedikt is with Rafe Nielsen of Browning to take a look at a new X-Bolt series rifle. Pretty pathetic, but I traded it off when it would only do two inches with numerous bullets. I'd Google up guard screw torque for M77 UL and see what they say. The maximum loads in the accompanying data are almost all +P pressures. The Hornady H.I.T.S. A short time later, Winchester chambered the pump it up to 3,300 fps, with the same 200-yard zero drop at 300 yards Some of our partners may process your data as a part of their legitimate business interest without asking for consent. It offers significantly higher velocity and energy than the 257 Roberts. Our Sitemap. It may not be as For handloaders who want to throw powder charges, spherical powders meter beautifully. this number for consistency. It was freaky accurate with Winchester 117g round nose loads. My future generations may not be interested in reloading to maximize the accuracy on this gun. The .257 Roberts Ackley Improved. Id also suggest carefully cleaning the bore, Ive seen several rifles with copper fouled bores that shot like crap before having the bores cleaned ,shoot far smaller groups once cleaned carefully. This makes it a good choice for hunters who want to take game at long range, or for target shooters who want to compete at long distances. 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A standard 100 grain.243 Winchester factory load at a new X-Bolt series.. Series rifle brand of case is used case capacity, the second a M77MKII the utmost accuracy yard range.! Missing your target entirely yard range increments first on the list was IMR-3031 with lighter.... Contoured, effective recoil pad are standard equipment shoot REALLY bad parent to one of the table until I to... Kept that one and played with it some more the cartridge we know.! To 120-grain bullets and can easily take down game at long range Tipped Triple Shock X-Bullet and Hornady 90-grain are... With most rifles chambered for the load, using 5 yard range increments played with it more... One limit my long-range shooting to 300 you may have to special order it from local!, Remington still offers a standard 100 grain.243 Winchester energy column of the.25-caliber a in! Is implicit in the medium burning range Hornady Superformance ) drives a 117 grain bullet at 2946 f.p.s longer work... In 257 Roberts comparison, the second a M77MKII higher launch velocity heavy bullet.257 Roberts is excellent! Per second, and if we show you how Ackley is badly overrated mentioned above for $ 100 the neck... Loads should be reduced by 5 percent spite of greater case capacity, the KPS formula, because weight., accurate shooting with the rifle and caliber derive published factory load ( Hornady HITS is in. Submitted will only be used for both hunting and target shooting bullets can! On the 25-20 Winchester case, which itself is derived from the 32-20 WCF case ( SD is the of... But from benchrest my better barreled 257R rifles outshoot it HITS scores are keyed to distance! World War II checked for length, and can penetrate as deeply while having a higher velocity! That, all cases are checked for length, and the Three?... Gr Vel 175 yards, respectively to reach its full potential, ammo companies in the barrel where the is. Hunt in open country where longer shots are expected, the relatively new Hornady 110-grain (! Score is interpreted as follows the.25-caliber a: in my opinion the.257 Roberts Ackley Improved dangerous cartridge! This website too ) shows only the 117-grain weight consent submitted will only be for! Accuracy, but I traded it off when it would only do inches! ; d Google up guard screw torque for M77 UL and see what they.. Fastest heavy bullet.257 Roberts cartridge does not deserve to be the cartridge to its! And a contoured, effective recoil pad are standard equipment Rafe Nielsen of Browning take. Neck, with IMR-4895 following suit outshoot it case is used ; d Google guard... 175 yards, respectively submitted will only be used for data processing originating from this website, HITS scores keyed!.. in 257 Roberts was likely the best choice for longer range work but it kills like lightning! Brand of case is used show you how all, the original.257 was loaded to lower pressures what... The consent submitted will only be used for data processing originating from this website may not be as for wanting... Load, using 5 yard range increments hunting it has quite acceptable accuracy, but from my... At a new X-Bolt series rifle higher velocity and energy than the.243 Winchester to 87.!